Book Club is Back!

Welcome to the Spring 2011 Four Points Book Club! We're so glad that you've decided to join us as we read Same Kind of Different as Me by Ron Hall and Denver Moore.

Please check back in a day or two for our first set of discussion questions. Our next meeting will be on Wednesday, March 30, and we'll be talking about Chapters 1-17. Hope you can make it!

Chapters 16-18

"A Morning of Sorrows"

1. "This morning you're going to need a father" (219). Do you believe that God reveals Himself according to our need? If so, in what different ways has God revealed Himself to you?
2. "Nothing is a ritual, Mackenzie" (220). What do we tend to make ritual? What's the harm? Consider, for example, the rituals we enjoy so much this time of year (decorating the tree, buying presents, even attending a Christmas service). Do these things detract or add to our relationships with God and others?
3. "I don't do humiliation, or guilt, or condemnation. They don't produce one speck of wholeness or righteousness, and that is why they were nailed into Jesus on the cross" (223). These are tough things to talk about, but dig deep for a minute. Do you carry a sense of guilt or shame? Do you feel obligated to do so? Destined to do so? Does God want us to carry condemnation? How do we find the freedom to let go?
4. "I want to help you take on that nature that finds more power in love and forgiveness than hate" (225). If there is more power and freedom in love, why do hold on so tightly to hate? What do we gain from holding onto bitterness, unforgiveness, fear, etc.? How is love more powerful than hate?
5. "Just say it out loud. There is power in what my children declare" (227). To what extent do you believe saying "I forgive you" aloud can change the condition of your heart? Have you ever tried anything like it? What was the result? Finally, what does this idea say about the nature of forgiveness?

"Choices of the Heart"

1. "Mack, if anything matters then everything matters. Because you are important, everything you do is important" ( 235). What does this passage mean to you? If it's true, how does it challenge you and the choices you make?
2. As Mack prepares to leave the shack, he gives Jesus his tin box, saying "I don't think I'm going to need it anymore...All my best treasures are now hidden in you." What treasures are in your tin box? What does it mean for us to hand Jesus our tin boxes?
3. "It was more likely he was back in the un-real world" (237). In what ways is our world "un-real"?

"Outbound Ripples"

1. The circumstances of Mack's accidents and the injuries he sustained will likely make it difficult for others to believe his experience with Papa at the shack. Have you ever experienced a supernatural encounter with God that you're hesitant to share with others?
2. What message does Mack have for Willie?
3. What enables Nan to believe?

"After Words"

1. Mack's message for Willie was simple: "Tell Willie that I'm especially fond of him." Willie says later that Mack's story has deeply touched and changes his life. What simple message of "The Shack" has touched your heart and perhaps even changed your perspective?
2. Willie says that Mack now lives with a "profound sense of joy" (247). Do you?

Chapters 12-15

“In the Belly of the Beasts”

1. “Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from a religious conviction.” This quote brings to mind the Crusades, the Salem witch trials, and other historical tragedies. But can you think of other, more ordinary (and therefore even scarier) examples of this idea?
2. “This always works better when we do it together, don’t you think?” (174). When is the last time you tried to accomplish the impossible all by yourself? What was the outcome?
3. How does a person “live loved” (175)? Are you living loved? By whom?
4. “Instead [heaven is] a new cleansing of this universe, so it will indeed look a lot like here” (177). Is this portrait of heaven biblically accurate? What do you imagine heaven to look like?
5. Jesus talks about the church, his “bride,” on pages 177-178. How does a person get to be part of the church Jesus is talking about? In your experience, is the church today more relational than institutional or more institutional than relational? Who builds Jesus’ church? How?
6. Why would Jesus say he is not fond of religion, politics or economics? In your experience, are these systems the trinity of terrors Jesus refers to them as? How?
7. “All I want from you is to trust me with what little you can, and grow in loving people around you with the same love I share with you. It’s not your job to change them, or to convince them. You are free to love without an agenda” (181). Does this statement challenge your views on evangelism and sharing the gospel? How?
8. What might Jesus mean when he says “Who said anything about being a Christian? I’m not a Christian” (182)?
9. Do all roads lead to God or does God travel all roads to find his children?

“A Meeting of the Hearts”

1. “Grace doesn’t depend on suffering to exist, but where there is suffering you will find grace in many facets and colors” (185). Where have you seen grace in the midst of tragedy?
2. “So when you don’t hear me the first time, I’m not frustrated or disappointed, I’m thrilled. Only forty-six more times to go” (187). Again, I’m reminded of the children’s song “He’s Still Working on Me.” Are there areas of your life that you feel you’ve been “working on” for far too long? Does Papa’s explanation of the changing process offer you any encouragement?
3. “…my love is bigger than your stupidity” (189). No question here, just wanted to offer up a big AMEN and THANK YOU JESUS for that one!
4. “There are many folk like you, Mackenzie, who end up locking themselves into a very small place with a monster that will ultimately betray them, that will not fill or deliver what they thought it would” (189). What “monsters” have you imprisoned yourself with, hoping all the while that they might bring fulfillment or satisfaction?
5. Papa says that love would cease to exist if he revoked the choices of independence. Why?
6. “Just because you make horrendous and destructive choices does not mean you deserve less respect for what you inherently are—the pinnacle of my Creation and the center of my affection” (190). We often feel unworthy of God’s love—anybody’s love—because of our past mistakes. To what extent has this book challenged your self view?
7. “He…kissed Papa on the check…” (193). How can we show such sweet affection to God?

“Verbs and Other Freedoms”

1. “God is a verb” (194). What does that mean?
2. Sarayu: I am always with you; sometimes I want you to be aware in a special way—more intentional (195). Have you ever sensed the Holy Spirit’s presence?
3. “Paradigms power perception and perceptions power emotions” (197). What is the danger in trusting our emotions? As women, are we particularly prone to allow our emotions to govern our attitudes and behaviors?
4. “…relationships are a whole lot messier than rules, but rules will never give you the answers to the deep questions of the heart and they will never love you” (198). What best describes your relationship with God, rules or relationship? Why might relationships be more complicated than rules? Why might they be simpler?
5. Describe the difference between right answers and the living answer. What might a relationship with the right answer produce in your life? How would you feel? What would you do? How would it affect relationships with others?What might a relationship with the living answer produce in your life? How would you feel? What would you do? How would it affect relationships with others?
6. Why does Sarayu say “the Bible does not teach you to follow rules” when there are plenty of commands written in it?
7. Sarayu: I have a great fondness for uncertainty (203). Do you think this could be true? Why might the Holy Spirit prefer uncertainty to certainty?

“A Festival of Friends”

1. Have you ever seen the heavens declare the glory of God? Tell us about it.
2. Why is Sarayu hard to look at? What does it represent?
3. What is your overall reaction to the description of the festival? Could any earthly imagination portray the reality of heaven? Why or why not?
4. Why are all the color patterns of light unique?
5. What is the point of Mack meeting his father now?
6. Will there be a need for reconciliation in heaven?
7. How did Mack feel when the festival was over? Why?

Chapters 8-11

"A Breakfast of Champions"

1. "Mackenzie, I have no favorites; I am just especially fond of him" (118). To what extent to you believe God is especially fond of you? Describe a specific time that you felt certain of His affection.
2. "I don't need to punish people for sin. Sin is its own punishment, devouring you from the inside" (120). To what extent do you agree that sin is its own punishment? Have you observed sin in someone's life that seems to go unpunished? How is sin punishment?
3. "If you had truly learned to regard each other's concerns as significant as your own, there would be no need for hierarchy" (124). Is it possible to live self-sacrificially and without hierarchies? Where does that idea begin to break down?
4. "But your choices are also not stronger than my purposes, and I will use every choice you make for ultimate good and the most loving outcome" (125). Can you recall a poor choice you once made that has resulted in unimaginable good?
5. "The real underlying flaw in your life, Mackenzie, is that you don't think I am good" (126). Do you believe God is good? More importantly, do your choices, actions, and reactions demonstrate that you truly believe God is good?
6. "We're not justifying it. We are redeeming it" (127). Consider the difference between "justify" and "redeem." Why might Papa have felt it necessary to distinguish these two terms as they relate to suffering?

"A Long Time Ago, In a Garden Far, Far Away"

1. "For whatever reason, Mack had expected a perfectly manicured and ordered English garden. This was not that!" (128). What does the state of the garden reveal about the Holy Spirit and his work in us?
2. "As they walked...he relaxed what he hadn't realized he had been clenching" (129). When walking with the Spirit, have you ever released something you didn't realize you were holding onto? What might you be clenching now that the Spirit would like to see you let go of?
3. "It's not the work, but the purpose that makes it special" (131). Sarayu's work is arduous, but she delights in the higher purpose. What arduous work has the Spirit led you to carry out? What is the higher purpose?
4. "Humans have a great capacity for declaring something good or evil, without truly knowing" (133). How do we judge what is good and what is evil? Are good and evil relative?
5. "Sarayu was somehow able to reach deep under the ground and find the ends of the roots, bringing them effortlessly to the surface" (133). Have you ever felt the Spirit tugging away at a deep root within your soul? Why is necessary to dig up that old root? (For fun, look a few lines down at what Sarayu plans to do with those roots. Any metaphorical significance here?)
6. "Rights are where survivors go, so that they won't have to work out relationships" (137). We live in a nation that clings to our "rights," but do they really exist? What about our perceived subconscious rights? For example, our right to be right? Our right to be appreciated? Our right to "alone time" (these are just a few of mine). Can you identify some of yours? What might happen in our relationships if we gave up those rights?
7. "This mess is you! Together, you and I, we have been working with a purpose in your heart. And it is wild and beautiful and perfectly in process. To you it seems like a mess, but to me, I see a perfect pattern emerging and growing alive--a living fractal!" (138). I find this passage to be particularly encouraging...do you? If so, why?

"Wade in the Water"

1. As this chapter opens, Jesus invites Mack to walk on water. Mack finds the suggestion absurd, but he eventually trusts Jesus and steps out in faith. Have you ever felt God asking you to take a giant step of faith, one that others might consider foolish or ill-fated? Did you hesitate? If so, would you do things differently now? Why? Why not?
2. "But without wisdom, imagination is a cruel taskmaster" (141). How might imagination be cruel? Jesus tells Mack that the human imagination is powerful. How so?
3. "...do you think humans were designed to live in the present or the past or the future?" (141). Where do you spend most of your time living?
4. A few passages worth noting from page 142: "Mack, do you realize that your imagination of the future, which is almost always dictated by fear of some kind, rarely, if ever, pictures me there with you?...It is impossible for you to take power over the future because it isn't even real, nor will it ever be real. You try and play God, imagining the evil that you fear becoming a reality, and then you try and make plans and contingencies to avoid what you fear....To the degree that those fears have a place in your life, you neither believe I am good nor know keep in your heart that I love you." I found these passages to be particularly challenging. What does our fear and worry communicate to God? What does it mean if we say that we fully trust God and yet worry about our future and our children's future?
5. "Humans, who have been given the task to lovingly steer the world, instead plunder her with no consideration, other than their immediate needs" (144). Do we have an obligation to care for Earth? As Christians, how might we lead our families and communities in this challenge?
6. "In fact, we are submitted to you in the same way" (145). How can God be in submission to His creation?
7. "Women, in general, will find it difficult to turn from a man and stop demanding that he meets their needs, provides security, and protects their identity, and return to me. Men, in general, find it very hard to turn from the works of their hands, their own quest for power and security and significance, and return to me" (145). How have you seen this idea manifested in your own marriage or significant relationships? What is the result when we seek fulfillment in others or ourselves?
8. What do you make of Jesus' reaction to the "WWJD" phenomenon (149). According to Jesus, why does that mantra fall short?

"Here Come Da Judge"

1. "So then, Mackenzie, may I ask which of your children you love the most?" (154). What might be Sophia's purpose behind this question?
2. "So many believe it is the love that grows, but it is the knowing that grows and love simply expands to contain it" (155). How does this concept relate to our relationship with God and our love for Him?
3. Why did Mack not truly believe God is good? What area in your life causes you to wonder if God is truly good to you? (Even if you don't feel comfortable answering out loud, this is a question that might be worth thinking about.)
4. Sophia asks Mack by what criteria does he make his judgements, and his methods of judging all seem foolish and illogical. What is your criteria? Appearance, education, associations, behavior? To what extent are our judgements of others self-serving?
5. "Judging requires that you think yourself superior over the one you judge" (159). Given the previous chapter's discussion on submission, what is God's view of our perceived superiority? Might your actions ever communicate a sense of superiority over others?
6. How have we passed judgement on God?
7. "Could I go instead? If you need someone to torture for eternity, I'll go in their place. Would that work? Could I do that?" (163). What does Mack learn about God when asked to choose which of his children will go to hell? Of what does he judge his children worthy?

Chapters 5-7

Okay, ladies! It's time for our next chunk of chapters! Forgive me for getting these questions up a little later in the week. God bless and happy reading!

“Guess Who’s Coming to Dinner”

1. “Sometimes honesty can be incredibly messy” (68). Mack says he doesn’t tell Nan about the note for her own sake, but then admits that revealing this secret would mean revealing even deeper secrets that he has kept from her. Do you have secrets that you have justified? Are you ever afraid that honesty can indeed be too messy to bother with?

2. “I know it sounds crazy, but somehow I feel strangely drawn to find out for sure” (70). Have you ever felt “strangely drawn” to meet with God?

3. “…he was looking directly into the face of a large beaming African-American woman” (82). Surprised? Does this portrayal of God make us uncomfortable? If so, why? If you were to create a tangible image, what would God look like? What might that image reveal about your understanding or perception of God? What does this particular image suggest?

4. “And that gun?” (83). What defenses do you take / have you taken to meet with God? For example, do you find that you sometimes come to God with passive aggression? Denial? Seeming indifference? Excuses? How does God disarm us?

5. Reread the 3rd paragraph on page 85 beginning “Mack tried again…” What does this description reveal about the Holy Spirit?

6. Is it significant that God is described as a housekeeper, cook, gardener, and handyman? How do these occupations relate to Mack’s mental, emotional, and spiritual state?

7. “I somehow believed” (87). Has anything ever compelled you to believe?

“A Piece of π”

1. “I have no magic wand…” (92). I find this quote to be surprisingly challenging. Don’t we sometimes assume that God can wave His hand and remove evil, sorrow, etc.? Can’t He? And if He can, why does He sometimes choose not to? What is there to be gained through “time and a lot of relationship”? Relationship with whom?

2. According to Papa, what keeps us from falling back into our “religious conditioning” (93)? What is “religious conditioning”? To what extent have you been religiously conditioned?

3. “Although [Jesus] is also fully God, he had never drawn upon his nature as God to do anything. He has only lived out of his relationship with me…” (99) Consider the following verse from Philippians: “Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, but made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness. And being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient to death.” How does the notion that Christ was fully human and never drew upon his divine nature affect you? What if we truly believed that the fullness of God and His power lived within us?

4. “Remember this, humans are not defined by their limitations, but by the intentions that I have for them; not by what they seem to be, but by everything it means to be created in my image” (100). What defines you?

5. “Not that I actually believed any of it…” (102). What truth do you find difficult to believe because of past experiences?

6. What do you make of the title, “A Piece of π”?

“God on the Dock”

1. As this chapter opens, Jesus spills a bowl of batter onto the floor. Do you think this scene reveals anything about the nature of our humanity and God’s reaction to it?

2. “As we are listening to you, it is as if this is the first time we have known about them, and we take great delight in seeing them through your eyes” (106). What is the purpose of prayer if God is all-knowing? (Some verses that might be helpful: Psalms 139:4, Hebrews 4:13, Matthew 12:25, Mark 2:8.)

3. “…a time of devotion…Something simple, warm, intimate, genuine; this was holy” (107). Do we tend to over-complicate our “quiet times”? What do you think God desires of us when we talk with Him?

4. “I feel more comfortable around you” (110). Are you more comfortable with Jesus than the Father? In what ways does that demonstrate itself?

5. “Yes. She is Creativity; she is Action; she is the Breathing of Life; she is much more. She is my Spirit” (110). How do you see or describe the Holy Spirit?

6. “Being always transcends appearance” (112). How much stock do we put in our own appearance and that of others while neglecting our being? How many of our insecurities stem from image?

7. “…the wastefulness of creation” (113). Can you recall a moment when you were awestruck by the beauty of our world? Why did God create such a lavish Earth?

8. “I feel so lost,” says Mack. Jesus responds, “You are not lost” (114). Have you ever felt lost on your spiritual journey?

9. How do you feel about the casualness of the conversation between Mack and the Godhead?

Chapters 1-4

Welcome to the Bookclub! We're so excited to finally meet all you fabulous women and introduce this semester's reading selection, The Shack. Each meeting will focus on a specific reading (see the schedule to the side). We'll use the following discussion questions to help guide our time together, but please feel free to bring your own questions, ideas, opinions, responses, etc. to our get-togethers. This can be a challenging book, but stick with it. (You may find "The Great Sadness" particularly hard to read, but I PROMISE it gets easier!).

I encourage you to really engage with the book; mark it up, write notes in the margin, and then bring all of that wonderful insight to our meeting. You never know how your understanding and perspective might be just what someone else is needing to hear.

Okay, so here are our first set of discussion questions. YOU DO NOT NEED TO PREPARE ANSWERS FOR ANY OF THESE! They are simply a way to get us all thinking about the same questions / topics.

The Foreword and “A Confluence of Paths”

1. The Shack is considered “theological fiction.” Do you find that to be a contradiction of terms? Can art, creativity, and theology be intermixed?

The Forward.

1. Mack is described as “not very religious” and as having a “love/hate relationship with Religion” (10). Why is religion capitalized? Do we tend to worship / love religion rather than God Himself? How would you describe your relationship with religion?

2. “While Mack’s relationship with God is wide, Nan’s is deep” (11). How would you describe your relationship with God? What does it mean to have a wide versus a deep relationship with Him?

3. Compare the ice storm (15) to Romans 1:19-20 (The Message):"But the basic reality of God is plain enough. Open your eyes and there it is! By taking a long and thoughtful look at what God has created, people have always been able to see what their eyes as such can't see: eternal power, for instance, and the mystery of his divine being."How could Mack's understanding of who God is have changed if he had considered God in what he saw in the snow and ice storm? What things did he see in the ice storm that he could have seen was true about God?

4. Chapter 1, “A Confluence of Paths,” hinges on Mack’s invitation to meet “Papa” at the very place of his greatest suffering. Do we each have an invitation? How did Mack react to his? How have you reacted to yours?

5. Have you ever noticed that an invitation to pain (often deep pain) is also an invitation to grace (consider the story of Job)? Have you ever experienced this?

6. What comes into our minds when we think about God is the most important thing about us. –A.W. Tozier. “Papa was Nan’s favorite name for God and it expressed her delight in the intimate friendship she had with him” (22). What does Nan’s name for God reveal about their relationship? What name / term comes to mind when you think of God? What might that reveal about your relationship with God?

7. “Finally, he gave up, folded the note, slid it into a small tin box he kept on the desk, and switched off the light” (22). What might be the significance of the tin box? Do you have any metaphorical tin boxes? What do you store away there?

“The Gathering Dark” and “The Tipping Point”

1. At the end of the chapter, Mack talks to Missy about the Multnomah princess story (27-28), which leads into a discussion of God. Who do you feel better understands the nature of God, Mack or Missy? With whom do you most relate?

2. “Then how come [God’s] so mean?” (31). Why is it sometimes easier to see God as anything but a loving Papa? What influences distort our understanding of God?

3. “The Gathering Dark” makes reference to the events in our life that change our relationship with God. In the book, a simple camping trip sets up events that forever change Mack and his relationship with God. What are the events in your life that have led you to where you are in your relationship with God?

4. “[Nan] even calls him Papa because of the closeness of their relationship…It just seems a little too familiar for me. Anyway, Nan has a wonderful father, so I think it’s just easier for her” (37-38). To what extent do your relationships with your parents, particularly your relationship with your father, affect your understanding of God?

5. The author uses an interesting play on words in the title for this chapter, “The Tipping Point.” Tipping refers to the canoe tipping, as well as the tipping point in a faith walk. The event of losing Missy starts a long process of Mack addressing his relationship with God. Have you experienced a tipping point?